groomer Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 take a close look at the sled tracks .i was at the st fidele c b this morning around 9 15 am .went on the c b to take pics .there s was a guy with his wife at the warming shack .went back to the machine to clean the drag . both arrived and i talked with the guy for a minute ,both had their own sleds.those who come often in my area must know for sure that first hill west of the c b .for sure , 1 .5 mile long .it s a long way up before arriving on top .few bad curves on the way up . started grooming again going west.those 2 guys are going west too !! take a close look at their sled tracks . fyi ,my drag is 9 ' wide .hills ,no hills ,curves ,no curves , they stayed on the left side of the trail for at least 5-6 miles .lost their tracks in the ''drifts area '' some peoples are really '' twits '' (to be polite ) they don t care about the life of the others . i was so mad ,i almost forgot about my grooming on the way up in the first hills . groomer !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 That is kind of scary. But I'm not surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTSE800 Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 Groomer, I notice that alot when I am out riding. I will be on a freshly groomed trail and I see a set of sled tracks, and I try and figure out what way they are going? No F...... Idea, it's a scary thought thats for sure..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowmonkey Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 Its amazing how many people are born without common sense!! Also very scary!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groomer Posted February 4, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 i groom since the last 9 years and its very easy to make the difference between those who know how to travel and those who don t . some group have very good lead dog ,they know their signs and its just clean and simple . some wave at you ,they don t their signs and i don t know if they want to say ''hi '' or how many in the group or whatever the reasons .those should keep their hands on the handle bar all the time and look ahead . some they don t have the patience to wait 5-10-20 '' to give me a chance to get out of a curve or something else .if they could park their sleds on the ''packer '' ,they would probably to it . yesterday in town ,i was going up a little hill with a slight right hand curve ,guy was just next to the packer ,unable to wait he passed me ,went in the field next to the trail ,made a very little ''loop '' and went back in the trail the other way ....a??h??? groomer !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rfm Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 Groomer Thanks for the reminder of just what and or who might be coming around the next corner. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groomer Posted February 4, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 Groomer Thanks for the reminder of just what and or who might be coming around the next corner. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldsmoke1 Posted February 4, 2009 Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 there is stupid people everywhere it dont supprise me hey groomer in leavin thurs day night with my wife and of course dad cant leave him home lol hope to see ya somewhere in groomer land next week where was that groomer down was it on the south shore ? coldsmoke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groomer Posted February 4, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2009 there is stupid people everywhere it dont supprise me hey groomer in leavin thurs day night with my wife and of course dad cant leave him home lol hope to see ya somewhere in groomer land next week where was that groomer down was it on the south shore ? coldsmoke hi coldsmoke !! the groomer i was talking about is the br in albertville .club west from us helped us to groom.from the clubhouse going toward west .i was grooming from home toward the clubhouse . tomorrow night ,i ll groom from home toward the clubhouse ,then west til the intersection of the other club. i ll let the surtrac in albertville tomorrow night and they ll groom trail 587 saturday i guess and probably back on their part of tq 5 sunday. i should be back on my part of tq 5 sunday night or early monday morning . hope to see you again . groomer !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blizzman Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 c. V-1.2, r.1.1 Regulation respecting off-highway vehicles An Act respecting off-highway vehicles (R.S.Q., c. V-1.2, ss. 46 and 87 ; 2004, c. 27, s. 2) DIVISION 5 OFF-HIGHWAY CLUB AND SIGNING 15. All signs erected by an off-highway vehicle club on a trail it operates must be maintained in good condition by the club during the period of use of the trail. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 15. 16. An off-highway vehicle club must erect a red, amber and green traffic signal at all trail crossings and at all intersections referred to in section 2 where there is no mandatory stop sign. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 16. 17. Every off-highway vehicle club must erect the following signs on its trails : (1) the regulatory signs illustrated in Schedule 2, comprising the following : (a) a P-10 mandatory stop sign, in particular for the purposes of section 2 at a crossing of trails laid out for off-highway vehicle traffic or for another sport, unless there is a written agreement between the operators of the trails that ensures safety at the crossing ; (B) a P-70 speed limit sign ; © a P-70-P tab sign installed below a P-70 residential area sign, for the purposes of section 1 ; (d) a P-80-3 sign indicating two-way traffic ; and (e) a P-90-D sign indicating an obstruction to avoid ; (2) the warning signs illustrated in Schedule 3, comprising the following : (a) a D-10-1 sign indicating a stop sign ahead ; (B) a D-50-1 sign indicating a traffic signal ahead ; © a D-90-1 sign indicating the beginning of a divided trail ; (d) a D-90-2 sign indicating the end of a divided trail ; (e) D-110-1-D and D-110-1-G signs indicating a 90° curve ; and (f) D-290-D and D-290-G signs indicating an obstruction or other hazard ; and (3) the roadwork signs illustrated in Schedule 4, comprising the following : (a) a T-50-1 sign indicating roadwork ; (B) a T-50-P tab sign indicating the extent of the roadwork ; © T-80-9 and T-80-10 signs indicating that the trail is closed ; (d) T-90-1, T-90-2-D and T-90-2-G signs indicating a detour ; and (e) T-90-3-D and T-90-3-G signs indicating a detour ahead. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 17. 18. The signs referred to in section 17 and every other sign erected by a club must be the following colours and bear the following markings and numerals : (1) regulatory signs must have a black border 6 millimetres in width set in 4 millimetres from the edge of the sign and bear a black symbol or black letters on a white background, except for the mandatory stop sign, which must bear white letters 127 millimetres in height and have a white border 12 millimetres in width on a red background ; (2) warning signs, with the exception of hazard markers, must have a black border 6 millimetres in width set in 4 millimetres from the edge of the sign and bear a black symbol on a yellow background, except for the D-10-1 sign, which is red ; and (3) roadwork signs must have a black border 6 millimetres in width set in 4 millimetres from the edge of the sign and bear a black symbol on an orange background. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 18. 19. The sign shapes must be as follows : (1) regulatory signs must be rectangular, with the exception of the mandatory stop sign which must be octagonal ; (2) danger and roadwork signs must be diamond-shaped or square, with the exception of hazard markers which must be rectangular. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 19. 20. The sign dimensions must be as follows : (1) rectangular signs : 300 mm x 375 mm ; (2) square and diamond-shaped signs : 300 mm x 300 mm. Despite subparagraph 1 of the first paragraph, the dimensions of D-290-D and D-290-G signs may not be less than 150 mm x 450 mm. Despite subparagraph 2 of the first paragraph, the dimensions of P-10, D-10 and D-50-1 signs may not be less than 450 mm x 450 mm. The dimensions of signs and the symbols and legend displayed on them may be greater than the dimensions prescribed in the first paragraph provided that the dimensions remain in proportion to each other. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 20. 21. All signs must be covered with retroreflective sheeting, with the exception of the black items. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 21. 22. The signs must be visible at all times and be placed on the right side of the trail, facing approaching traffic, not less than 500 millimetres or more than 2 metres from the area reserved for traffic. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 22. 23. The distance between the bottom edge of the sign or tab sign and the level of the trail may not be less than 1 metre or more than 2 metres, unless that distance must be increased to ensure the sign remains visible above snow accumulations. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 23. 24. Regulatory signs must be erected at the places where the requirement applies. Mandatory stop signs (P-10), however, must be placed as close as possible to the beginning of an intersection or road or railway crossing, at a distance of not more than 2 metres. Warning signs, with the exception of D-290-D and D-290-G signs, must be erected between 30 and 100 metres ahead of the obstruction or hazard. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 24. 25. No illustration, publicity or tourist advertisement may be placed on a sign or sign post, or be installed in such a way as to obstruct a sign or signal. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 25. 26. A trail whose lateral boundary lines are not marked by a fence or in another way and every trail which crosses a non-wooded area over a distance of more than 150 metres must be staked by the operator with red markers in the case of a snowmobile trail and with blue markers in the case of an all-terrain vehicle trail. The markers must be placed on both sides of the trail at intervals not exceeding 90 metres. Each marker must be not less than 25 millimetres in diameter and not less than 1.5 metres in height ; the height of a marker must be increased as required to ensure it remains visible above snow accumulations. Each marker must have a strip or plate of a resistant material 25 millimetres in width by 75 millimetres in height securely fixed to its upper edge. The surface of the strip or plate must be white or yellow and be covered with retroreflective sheeting. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 26. This is a 2000$ fine to the club. Want me to send them one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plain-rev Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 I'm not sure of your meaning??? are you saying it's the clubs fault these riders are on the wrong side of the trail?? this is a 2000$ fine to the club. Want me to send them one? if common sense doesn't keep them on the right side of the trail I don't think a sign of any color will do it either.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groomer Posted February 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 c. V-1.2, r.1.1Regulation respecting off-highway vehicles An Act respecting off-highway vehicles (R.S.Q., c. V-1.2, ss. 46 and 87 ; 2004, c. 27, s. 2) DIVISION 5 OFF-HIGHWAY CLUB AND SIGNING 15. All signs erected by an off-highway vehicle club on a trail it operates must be maintained in good condition by the club during the period of use of the trail. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 15. 16. An off-highway vehicle club must erect a red, amber and green traffic signal at all trail crossings and at all intersections referred to in section 2 where there is no mandatory stop sign. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 16. 17. Every off-highway vehicle club must erect the following signs on its trails : (1) the regulatory signs illustrated in Schedule 2, comprising the following : (a) a P-10 mandatory stop sign, in particular for the purposes of section 2 at a crossing of trails laid out for off-highway vehicle traffic or for another sport, unless there is a written agreement between the operators of the trails that ensures safety at the crossing ; (B) a P-70 speed limit sign ; © a P-70-P tab sign installed below a P-70 residential area sign, for the purposes of section 1 ; (d) a P-80-3 sign indicating two-way traffic ; and (e) a P-90-D sign indicating an obstruction to avoid ; (2) the warning signs illustrated in Schedule 3, comprising the following : (a) a D-10-1 sign indicating a stop sign ahead ; (B) a D-50-1 sign indicating a traffic signal ahead ; © a D-90-1 sign indicating the beginning of a divided trail ; (d) a D-90-2 sign indicating the end of a divided trail ; (e) D-110-1-D and D-110-1-G signs indicating a 90° curve ; and (f) D-290-D and D-290-G signs indicating an obstruction or other hazard ; and (3) the roadwork signs illustrated in Schedule 4, comprising the following : (a) a T-50-1 sign indicating roadwork ; (B) a T-50-P tab sign indicating the extent of the roadwork ; © T-80-9 and T-80-10 signs indicating that the trail is closed ; (d) T-90-1, T-90-2-D and T-90-2-G signs indicating a detour ; and (e) T-90-3-D and T-90-3-G signs indicating a detour ahead. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 17. 18. The signs referred to in section 17 and every other sign erected by a club must be the following colours and bear the following markings and numerals : (1) regulatory signs must have a black border 6 millimetres in width set in 4 millimetres from the edge of the sign and bear a black symbol or black letters on a white background, except for the mandatory stop sign, which must bear white letters 127 millimetres in height and have a white border 12 millimetres in width on a red background ; (2) warning signs, with the exception of hazard markers, must have a black border 6 millimetres in width set in 4 millimetres from the edge of the sign and bear a black symbol on a yellow background, except for the D-10-1 sign, which is red ; and (3) roadwork signs must have a black border 6 millimetres in width set in 4 millimetres from the edge of the sign and bear a black symbol on an orange background. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 18. 19. The sign shapes must be as follows : (1) regulatory signs must be rectangular, with the exception of the mandatory stop sign which must be octagonal ; (2) danger and roadwork signs must be diamond-shaped or square, with the exception of hazard markers which must be rectangular. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 19. 20. The sign dimensions must be as follows : (1) rectangular signs : 300 mm x 375 mm ; (2) square and diamond-shaped signs : 300 mm x 300 mm. Despite subparagraph 1 of the first paragraph, the dimensions of D-290-D and D-290-G signs may not be less than 150 mm x 450 mm. Despite subparagraph 2 of the first paragraph, the dimensions of P-10, D-10 and D-50-1 signs may not be less than 450 mm x 450 mm. The dimensions of signs and the symbols and legend displayed on them may be greater than the dimensions prescribed in the first paragraph provided that the dimensions remain in proportion to each other. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 20. 21. All signs must be covered with retroreflective sheeting, with the exception of the black items. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 21. 22. The signs must be visible at all times and be placed on the right side of the trail, facing approaching traffic, not less than 500 millimetres or more than 2 metres from the area reserved for traffic. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 22. 23. The distance between the bottom edge of the sign or tab sign and the level of the trail may not be less than 1 metre or more than 2 metres, unless that distance must be increased to ensure the sign remains visible above snow accumulations. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 23. 24. Regulatory signs must be erected at the places where the requirement applies. Mandatory stop signs (P-10), however, must be placed as close as possible to the beginning of an intersection or road or railway crossing, at a distance of not more than 2 metres. Warning signs, with the exception of D-290-D and D-290-G signs, must be erected between 30 and 100 metres ahead of the obstruction or hazard. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 24. 25. No illustration, publicity or tourist advertisement may be placed on a sign or sign post, or be installed in such a way as to obstruct a sign or signal. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 25. 26. A trail whose lateral boundary lines are not marked by a fence or in another way and every trail which crosses a non-wooded area over a distance of more than 150 metres must be staked by the operator with red markers in the case of a snowmobile trail and with blue markers in the case of an all-terrain vehicle trail. The markers must be placed on both sides of the trail at intervals not exceeding 90 metres. Each marker must be not less than 25 millimetres in diameter and not less than 1.5 metres in height ; the height of a marker must be increased as required to ensure it remains visible above snow accumulations. Each marker must have a strip or plate of a resistant material 25 millimetres in width by 75 millimetres in height securely fixed to its upper edge. The surface of the strip or plate must be white or yellow and be covered with retroreflective sheeting. O.C. 1222-2004, s. 26. This is a 2000$ fine to the club. Want me to send them one? < TÉ QUI TOÉ ???? i just woke up ,be careful with your language !!!! groomer !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blizzman Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 I'm not sure of your meaning??? are you saying it's the clubs fault these riders are on the wrong side of the trail?? if common sense doesn't keep them on the right side of the trail I don't think a sign of any color will do it either.. No but they can be sued for improper signage. There are no signs indicating stay right or hill. TÉ QUI TOÉ ????i just woke up ,be careful with your language !!!! groomer !!! c'est pas grave qui je suis. Click le lien et vous allez comprendre mes inquietude de signalisation. http://www.cyberpresse.ca/le-droit/actuali...d-poursuivi.php Je ne suis pas avec ce club. Publié le 22 décembre 2008 à 23h01 | Mis à jour le 22 décembre 2008 à 23h03 Le club de motoneige Pingouins de Mansfield poursuivi Votre courriel Un entrepreneur forestier de Pembroke a déposé vendredi, une poursuite de 9 millions $ contre le club de motoneige Pingouins de Mansfield à la suite d'un accident survenu sur un des sentiers du club. Le 23 mars 2006, Shannon Clouthier faisait partie d'un convoi de 10 motoneiges parties de Rapides-des-Joachims en direction du Joncas Lodge, en empruntant les sentiers 43 et 63. M. Clouthier conduisait la seconde motoneige. La poursuite mentionne que si le premier motoneigiste a été en mesure de freiner à temps et éviter un banc de neige « invisible » sur cette section du sentier emprunté par le convoi, il en a été autrement pour M. Clouthier. Dans la poursuite, le procureur de ce dernier, Me Benoit Duclos soumet que son client n'a eu aucune possibilité d'éviter le banc de neige avec le résultat que sa motoneige s'est envolée et que la victime a terminé sa course dans le banc de neige de l'autre côté de la route qui est aussi empruntée par des véhicules transportant des troncs d'arbres. Me Duclos soumet qu'il s'agit d'un cas flagrant de mauvaise signalisation pour ne pas dire d'absence totale de signalisation. La configuration des lieux ne permettait aucunement de prévoir un virage à 90 degrés permettant de poursuivre le trajet vers le Joncas, souligne le poursuivant. 12 heures au froid À la suite de cet accident survenu dans un endroit isolé à 70 kilomètres du moindre service, il a fallu 12 heures aux amis de M. Clouthier pour organiser son transport vers l'hôpital. En attente, la victime a donc été immobilisée dans le froid pendant tout ce temps. À la suite des blessures subies, l'incapacité physique de M. Clouthier qui avait 32 ans au moment de l'incident, a été évaluée à 65 % et il se retrouve donc dans l'impossibilité de continuer son emploi, se privant de revenus dépassant 250 000 $ par année. M. Clouthier réclame la somme de 8,7 millions $ pour lui-même, ainsi qu'un montant supplémentaire de 200 000 $ pour sa conjointe. La condition actuelle de M. Clouthier est entièrement imputable, selon la poursuite, à la négligence du club de motoneiges Pingouins de Mansfield. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groomer Posted February 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 i am an operator ,i can operate a chainsaw ,brushcutter and the groomer .personnally ,i do a lot of volunteering for my club and i can t do everything too !!! fyi , in the last 11 days , i groomed 10 days.i groom probably 70 % or close of all the trails we have . matapedia river here split the territory for the surtac and the br .on my side we are only 2 volunteers .me and a friend.as you must know it s really hard nowadays to find volunteers . ''they '' rather complaint instead of volunteering !!! i don t know how you say that in english ,but my runs are not ''milk runs '''. you could be surprise how much money i spend grooming for the club and i m not a millionnaire ,i do it because i like it and the salary is not much !!! ''this is a $$2000.00 fine for the club . '' WANT ME TO SEND THEM ONE ??? '' don t post things like that to me , i do so much volunteering for my club ,helping friends on forums and perfect strangers . be careful next time ,but thanks for the advice tho !!!! groomer !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sled Dog Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 Blizzman are you serious? Just trying to get everyone worked up?? It worked!! "No but they can be sued for improper signage. There are no signs indicating stay right or hill." Are you saying there needs to be signs to stay right at the top of a hill??? People need to be responsible for their own actions. Bad thing about those pics is if something did happen, it would have involved an innocent rider who was staying right. By your logic, we should post signs in the bathroom reading "pull down pants before taking a crap" Another vent on those pics, why would the riders ride on Groomers freshly groomed trail if they could avoid it?? Stay off it and let it set up if possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowmaster2112 Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 Groomer- on a little different subject........ What are you hearing from riders that are touring the peninsula right now regarding conditions?? Heading up there Saturday with some friends and have not seen any posts from anyone. Also have you noticed a decline in riders this season so far? If so what percentage would you say it is?? Regards, Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groomer Posted February 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 Groomer- on a little different subject........What are you hearing from riders that are touring the peninsula right now regarding conditions?? Heading up there Saturday with some friends and have not seen any posts from anyone. Also have you noticed a decline in riders this season so far? If so what percentage would you say it is?? Regards, Chris 2 weeks ago or so i was talking with one of the waitress at the clubhouse and she said for the month of january ,it has been low compared to yesteryears . just called to the clubhouse and she said traffic is increasing a bit ,looks better .'' normally '' february is the best month for tourists . about the pourcentage ,hard to tell for me since tq 5 is not in town anymore .must go 2 miles outside town to see tq 5 . read a few threads on the french forum and from what i ve read ,traffic will be heavier later in feb. have nt seen posts about conditions on french forum ,can t tell you . about 3 '' of fresh snow last night .temps are warm right now and windy .should drop by tomorrow . groomer !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowmonkey Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 Blizzman You cant be serious!!!!!! Common sense tells us if that were the case all we would see would be signs and i wouldnt enjoy the ride at all because there would be thousands of them within a mile. Wake up and get some common sense or maybe you should just volunteer!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowmonkey Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 Sorry, Groomer I forgot to say Thank You for all you do. I rode through your area 2 years ago and i have to tell you it still sticks in my head in the middle of july. Thanks Again, Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groomer Posted February 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 Sorry, Groomer I forgot to say Thank You for all you do. I rode through your area 2 years ago and i have to tell you it still sticks in my head in the middle of july. Thanks Again, Tim thanks tim !!! you re welcome ,always a pleasure to help friends. pics ,mount white and nicol albert on park matane .trail 595 is at the base of mount nicol albert groomer !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blizzman Posted February 9, 2009 Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 i am an operator ,i can operate a chainsaw ,brushcutter and the groomer .personnally ,i do a lot of volunteering for my club and i can t do everything too !!! fyi , in the last 11 days , i groomed 10 days.i groom probably 70 % or close of all the trails we have .matapedia river here split the territory for the surtac and the br .on my side we are only 2 volunteers .me and a friend.as you must know it s really hard nowadays to find volunteers . ''they '' rather complaint instead of volunteering !!! i don t know how you say that in english ,but my runs are not ''milk runs '''. you could be surprise how much money i spend grooming for the club and i m not a millionnaire ,i do it because i like it and the salary is not much !!! ''this is a $$2000.00 fine for the club . '' WANT ME TO SEND THEM ONE ??? '' don t post things like that to me , i do so much volunteering for my club ,helping friends on forums and perfect strangers . be careful next time ,but thanks for the advice tho !!!! groomer !!! Groomer I am a club director/volunteer. I am also a niveau 3 with the F.C.M.Q. I appreciate all the work. My concerns, are not that those of how much we do, it's the legal system that scares me when it come to injury and death. The article states, and I know the club President very well, that the lawer is using improper signage as the cause for the accident. It just worries me that any excuse can be used by these advocates to sue hard working clubs for the stupidity of others. Thank you for all your hard work. This is the message that i am putting out to you all. Blizzman are you serious? Just trying to get everyone worked up?? It worked!!"No but they can be sued for improper signage. There are no signs indicating stay right or hill." Are you saying there needs to be signs to stay right at the top of a hill??? People need to be responsible for their own actions. Bad thing about those pics is if something did happen, it would have involved an innocent rider who was staying right. By your logic, we should post signs in the bathroom reading "pull down pants before taking a crap" Another vent on those pics, why would the riders ride on Groomers freshly groomed trail if they could avoid it?? Stay off it and let it set up if possible. Did you read the article or maybe you don"t understand french. I can Translate what I bolded. The Lawyer said that the accident is caused by poor signage. I don't disagree with you, but my awnser is in my above statement. Concerns for the club that any excuse can be used by advocates to sue them. Blizzman You cant be serious!!!!!! Common sense tells us if that were the case all we would see would be signs and i wouldnt enjoy the ride at all because there would be thousands of them within a mile. Wake up and get some common sense or maybe you should just volunteer!!!!! Believe me, I do alot of volunteer, 12 months of the year, from aquiring right of ways to trail developpent to pickets and fundraising events. I am and will alwas remain, a dedicated volunteer and Director on my club. My above statements are my concerns. Yes people are stupid, yes they should have common sense, but the reality is that not all do. And the Only way for us (Clubs and Clubs directors) are to watch out for ourselves. Do most of you realize that Club directors make decisions and that we in turn are responsible for the decisions that we make? Tell me howyou would feel if you ended up in court over a death issue and had to take the Stand. Again, I did not try to stir the pot, i am only giving my insight. Take it as you wish, yell at me if you want. I don't make the laws or the rules. We live in a changing world. Cheers to all, Blizzman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groomer Posted February 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 thanks for the info !! must go to do for some volunteering now !!! groomer !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sled Dog Posted February 10, 2009 Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 Blizzman, I see what your getting at now....Sounds like we are all looking at it the same way but the damn lawyers have to take common sense out of the equation!! And no, I don't speak french so thanks for translating...made more sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greasemonkey Posted February 10, 2009 Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 I've been thinking about this for awhile, since I read it, and I am slowly starting to burn from the inside out. I think, in order to curb the enthusiasm of lawyers to find a quick buck, maybe, anyone that buys a permit, must be asked to sign a legal release stating that they will not hold any club, landowner, or governing body responsible for their stupidity. I cannot see how anybody can think it would be someone else's fault if they get into an accident driving on the wrong side. What are we, in Europe? Something like this can really start a bad precedent. I can see it now, permits will go up to $500.00 so the clubs can buy all the "proper" signage. Then they would have to hire an engineering firm to make sure each sign is the proper distance from each hazard. Oh, and make sure they are the proper height, too. I could go on and on, but, it's no use. There will always be people out to make an easy buck on someone else's expense, in this case, the whole sport of snowmobiling. I know that a signed, legal document, for whatever reason, dosen't hold up in the court of law, I think that farse should change, too. Well, hope I don't sprain an ankle getting off my soapbox, I might have to sue myself! P.S., watch out for lawyers taking pictures on the trails! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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