NO MORE MIDNIGHT RUNS

[Trailblazer]

Well guys the last few days i have heard about this on the news but wasn't sure it was going to go through. Here's the link, basically it transilates into no riding between 10pm and 6am and on weekends we would be aloud to stay out untill 11pm.

http://lcn.canoe.ca/lcn/infos/national/archives/2010/09/20100930-073503.html

JG

[grumpysanta]

CURFEW well what little boys we are , i hear they will not inforce in the wilderness just close to homes

[Bill]

We try to be in well before 10pm, But ya know sometimes know matter how hard ya try it just does not happen.Towed friends it at 2am a few times LOL

[smclelan]

I am sure if a person was running a machine with stock exhaust making very little noise and respecting the homeowners there would be very little problem if you were caught after hours trying to get home or to your motel.

JMO

[dkarwh]

I am sure if a person was running a machine with stock exhaust making very little noise and respecting the homeowners there would be very little problem if you were caught after hours trying to get home or to your motel.

JMO

I agree that it would be unlikely that they would issue a ticket but there is always the cop that wouldn't want to hear the reason and write the ticket anyways. I haven't heard what the fine is yet. It may be more zoned in to the drinking crowd, lots of accidents occur after the bars close!

I wonder if our season's pass will be a third less? After all, we are losing a third of a day to ride!

Every year the noose gets a little tighter..

[iceman]

I got no problem with this.

No need to ride after 10 or 11 pm.

If you need it to be dark you probably are those who use the whole trail even in the daytime. Learn to ride on one side (your own please)

should be no drinking and riding period. I know it's done but it's a quick way to die or kill me thanks

Simple solution if you don't like it do not buy a pass and do not come to quebec.

Go ride Old Forge or somewhere.

Bad enough no one can stay on the trail and we are losing land use because guys need to play in powder on the farmers field now the same idiots will be out pissing off people at night.

Can't fix stupid.

[too slow]

I agree that it would be unlikely that they would issue a ticket but there is always the cop that wouldn't want to hear the reason and write the ticket anyways. I haven't heard what the fine is yet. It may be more zoned in to the drinking crowd, lots of accidents occur after the bars close!

I wonder if our season's pass will be a third less? After all, we are losing a third of a day to ride!

Every year the noose gets a little tighter..

Feel sorry for the guys that ride in on sleds....they will be forced to spend less time at the ballet.

[800steve]

Hey Iceman sorry Im stupid, but there has been plenty of nights that my group has been back after 10 at night, and not because we have been drinking. Alot of times we just ride a lot of miles. I sometimes enjoy riding at night, not alot of traffic and usually better trails, some are groomed early evening. Please dont lump us all into the drunk tank just because we like to ride all day.

[iceman]

Easy there 800steve

Stupid was the riding on the fields and pissing off land owners resulting in no trail.

I have had lots of late nights either because all went wrong that could OR all went awesome and there was no stopping.

It is dark real early in winter remember? You can still night ride in your less traffic on the "better trails" and do it all day too.

I did not say riding at night meant all were drinking.

I think it's only fair to respect the land owners and the nearby homeowners.

If everyone had stock exhaust and no stupid pipes we wouldn't need to be discussing any of this

I think the 10 pm weekdays and 11 pm weekends is reasonable. Better then no trail through at all.

Many take the trails as a given thing any time that can change. Would it be crazy yes the money sleds bring is big.

But times they are changing and we need to change as snowmobilers to work to keep all the trails we can open.

If it means trying to be in by 10 or 11 pm (shit happens sometimes yes) it's better then losing trails

[800steve]

Sorry Iceman but I did not like being told I ride on the wrong side of the trails becasuse I enjoy riding at night. I understand the issues for a curfew, I am a club president here in Vermont. We have the same problems. Please dont think all of us who ride at night are inconsiderate idiots.

[Shane]

Sorry Iceman but I did not like being told I ride on the wrong side of the trails becasuse I enjoy riding at night. I understand the issues for a curfew, I am a club president here in Vermont. We have the same problems. Please dont think all of us who ride at night are inconsiderate idiots.

Steve,

First allow me to say thank you for your "thankless" job as a club president. A lot of work and little help, reward or recognition for what are typically herculean efforts made on behalf of countless folks you don't even know.

I understand your point and I don't think that iceman was lumping all persons that ride at night together. This is an extremely touchy subject. I for one HATE beyond belief anyone ESPECIALLY government telling me what I can and cannot do. However, I must add the following; the "ban the can" movement is great! The NO ALCOHOL tolerance is PHENOMINAL, and the STAY ON THE TRAIL OR STAY HOME campaign is top notch! Loud exhaust (after market) has a place, on closed course competition circuits or on your OWN private land, not that of people who graciously allow all of us to cross theirs. If someone can't ride a snowmobile without consuming alcohol (which DOES impact ones abilities whether they care to admit it or not)then they need to seek help immediately. Should they wish to kill or mame themselves I say HAVE AT IT! However, that is not what often happens. These same irresponsible folk then attempt to pass blame for their immature behavior onto the land owner for allowing that pesky 200 year old oak tree to grow where it did and ultimately sue them and ruin access to that trail and potentially others for the rest of us.

It is true that a majority of people out late at night are out there after boozing it up. Not all. I too have rolled in very late for a multitude of reasons as mentioned above. We all just need to step back, take a deep breath and realize that we all love this sport more than anything else (next to our families). We need to work TOGETHER to ensure its longevity. Sometimes that means doing what is best for the sport as a whole and not what is best for us individually.

STAY ON THE TRAIL POR STAY HOME just about sums that one up. Unfortunately, the morons who fail to follow these rules are typically the same people who do nothing to help their clubs if they even join one, they are extremely quick to complain about every little thing, and are too stupid to know the difference.

Think snow!

Shane

Edited October 4, 2010 by Shane

[iceman]

Well said shane. Is true I DO NOT by any means believe everyone at night riding is drinking.

I just want all the trails we have now to stay open and hopefully we will gain some new ones. We need to respect the land owners period. Without them there is no real trail system.

[momojohnny]

Steve,

First allow me to say thank you for your "thankless" job as a club president. A lot of work and little help, reward or recognition for what are typically herculean efforts made on behalf of countless folks you don't even know.

I understand your point and I don't think that iceman was lumping all persons that ride at night together. This is an extremely touchy subject. I for one HATE beyond belief anyone ESPECIALLY government telling me what I can and cannot do. However, I must add the following; the "ban the can" movement is great! The NO ALCOHOL tolerance is PHENOMINAL, and the STAY ON THE TRAIL OR STAY HOME campaign is top notch! Loud exhaust (after market) has a place, on closed course competition circuits or on your OWN private land, not that of people who graciously allow all of us to cross theirs. If someone can't ride a snowmobile without consuming alcohol (which DOES impact ones abilities whether they care to admit it or not)then they need to seek help immediately. Should they wish to kill or mame themselves I say HAVE AT IT! However, that is not what often happens. These same irresponsible folk then attempt to pass blame for their immature behavior onto the land owner for allowing that pesky 200 year old oak tree to grow where it did and ultimately sue them and ruin access to that trail and potentially others for the rest of us.

It is true that a majority of people out late at night are out there after boozing it up. Not all. I too have rolled in very late for a multitude of reasons as mentioned above. We all just need to step back, take a deep breath and realize that we all love this sport more than anything else (next to our families). We need to work TOGETHER to ensure its longevity. Sometimes that means doing what is best for the sport as a whole and not what is best for us individually.

STAY ON THE TRAIL POR STAY HOME just about sums that one up. Unfortunately, the morons who fail to follow these rules are typically the same people who do nothing to help their clubs if they even join one, they are extremely quick to complain about every little thing, and are too stupid to know the difference.

Think snow!

Shane

Sorry to read this new rule. Hey Shane did you run in Norm Dashers poker run on LG in May? Im over there a couple of times a yr (LG) with my Donzi. Michael Edited October 6, 2010 by momojohnny

[Shane]

Sorry to read this new rule. Hey Shane did you run in Norm Dashers poker run on LG in May? Im over there a couple of times a yr (LG) with my Donzi. Michael

Hi Michael. No I did not. I believe it was canceled and they had a demonstration race instead. I hope you are well.

[MrGutz]

I saw this on HCS posted by Quebec#1, it has a petition to fill out/sign, maybe it can help?

HCS Link

"Again more rules and regulations for snowmobilers in Quebec . They want to pass a law that bands snowmobiles from 10pm at night to 6 am in the morning. This could hurt the sport and businesses accross Quebec. Too many laws and fewer rights these days.

Please help us fight this by filling out this petition ! The more the better !

Heres the english forum(the text is in french) but where you have to fill out your info its english.

Petition

Edited October 7, 2010 by Mid Range

[Mid Range]

It says in the article above that municipalities will have the last word wether or not they will apply this law(should it be passed) within their territories.In other words....it will be up to them to put this law in place or not.

But in the meantime.....there is a much more important issue that the Government must deal with:THE FARMERS!!!

[MrGutz]

Can you summerize the issues the farmers are facing?

Should we support them, even if it hurts us in the short term?

Later

GutZ

[towing]

The Farmers issues are mainly with the modification that have been made to their compensation plans by 'La Financiere Agricole' their insurance company that I think is controled by the goverment. Their protest and claims are surely founded but have nothing to do with us... we are used to put pressure on the government... once again... <_<

But don't forget that they had give us acces to their land for free since the beginning of the trail system... it deserve some respect...

Fortunately, not all the trails are threat by this conflict that will propably solve at the first snowfalls... as usual

Alain

[Mid Range]

Can you summerize the issues the farmers are facing?

Should we support them, even if it hurts us in the short term?

Later

GutZ

The curfew and the farmers issue are 2 different things.I can live with the first one but as we speak,if the Government of Québec sticks to his position.The Farmers across many regions in Québec will block any access to their lands to off-road vehicles including us.Even the dairy farmers from Saguenay Lac St-Jean are joining this movement.

[Greg du Vermont]

The curfew is part of a proposed new law petaining to off road vehicle operation and is not final yet. As it has here, the curfew componet is recieving alot of attention. I have details on it and what is being done to try and make modification in the coming days. The petition which was referenced above is pertaining to a total rejection of the entire proposed law. The AdmdQ has developed a petition meeting all legal requirments (way more to it than you would think) regarding the curfew section. Stay tuned, I will share what I know and we can be a part of it.

[Fozzy]

I have to disagree with Iceman and Shane in saying that this ban may help save some trails. If the loss of trails is due to loud exhausts, which are already illegal in Quebec, then this should be the focus and not enforcing a curfew.

There is one thing you are not considering and that is the people who work all day, get home and see their family and get heir kids to bed and then meet with some buddies for a ride. This is me in large as unfortuntaley most of my riding is at night. I live right next to the Quebec provincial border and many times we head out around 8:30pm and are back at 12:30am.

[Shane]

I have to disagree with Iceman and Shane in saying that this ban may help save some trails. If the loss of trails is due to loud exhausts, which are already illegal in Quebec, then this should be the focus and not enforcing a curfew.

There is one thing you are not considering and that is the people who work all day, get home and see their family and get heir kids to bed and then meet with some buddies for a ride. This is me in large as unfortuntaley most of my riding is at night. I live right next to the Quebec provincial border and many times we head out around 8:30pm and are back at 12:30am.

You are indeed correct Fozzy and something I for one did not consider. That certainly adds a new dimension to the discussion and your point is well taken. I would ASSUME that the authors of the proposed curfew would argue that you are not the vast majority of night time riders. Right, wrong or indifferent, I can only bridge that gap and make that assumption. I am quite certain that the rationale is the drinking and riding and the loud pipes disturbing land owners during sleeping hours. I am not passing judgement here, just trying to think "out loud" if you will on here. Like I said, I HATE, I mean I become absolutely INFURIATED when some bureaucrat tries to dictate what I can or cannot do when there is no harm or potential harm to others person or property.

As to the after market exhaust issue, that is a rule we as riders need to band together and support. The primary reason being the risk/reward analysis. Meaning that most of the land that trails cross is private property. Id doing so, it is our OBLIGATION to go above and beyond the call of duty to be supportive of and NOT in ANY way shape or form, disturb, disrespect, insult, harm, damage or otherwise the land owner, his or her property, persons, livestock, crop, fields etc. as they are GRACIOUSLY ALLOWING us to cross THEIR land. Loud pipes are one of those things that ALL TRAIL RIDERS can do without. Racers on a closed course or those riding on THEIR OWN land have at it! Please don't ruin our riding by installing loud pipes. Like many other things, drinking and riding etc., just because it is the law there are still many running after market exhaust. I have Canadian friends that do it. We were out one spring and one got a ticket and I told him he deserved it.

These are difficult issues no doubt. We have to look at each of them independently of the other and make the decisions that are best for the sport LONG TERM. None are easy and all require sacrifice, something no one WANTS to do.

It is certainly nice to discuss these topics among mature adults who can discuss do so without insults and bring logical topics and insight to the table.

Shane

[scorpionbowl]

I've got no problem with this either. I've ridden tens of thousands of miles in Canada, and I've never been out past 10pm, nor would I want too. I feel bad enough driving past a homeowners window at 7am on a Sunday morning, and when I do, I wonder what they think when the sleds pass by late a night. Sure not everyone is drinking and driving over those hours, but the odds are a lot better that the person you meet has been...that's why I don't even like driving in my car past 11pm on weekend, near my house.

Plus, this would probably be enforced as well as the ban on pipes. Unfortunately, the honest few that ride then get screwed, but it's better than losing the trail for everyone...

[Greasemonkey]

Steve,

First allow me to say thank you for your "thankless" job as a club president. A lot of work and little help, reward or recognition for what are typically herculean efforts made on behalf of countless folks you don't even know.

I understand your point and I don't think that iceman was lumping all persons that ride at night together. This is an extremely touchy subject. I for one HATE beyond belief anyone ESPECIALLY government telling me what I can and cannot do. However, I must add the following; the "ban the can" movement is great! The NO ALCOHOL tolerance is PHENOMINAL, and the STAY ON THE TRAIL OR STAY HOME campaign is top notch! Loud exhaust (after market) has a place, on closed course competition circuits or on your OWN private land, not that of people who graciously allow all of us to cross theirs. If someone can't ride a snowmobile without consuming alcohol (which DOES impact ones abilities whether they care to admit it or not)then they need to seek help immediately. Should they wish to kill or mame themselves I say HAVE AT IT! However, that is not what often happens. These same irresponsible folk then attempt to pass blame for their immature behavior onto the land owner for allowing that pesky 200 year old oak tree to grow where it did and ultimately sue them and ruin access to that trail and potentially others for the rest of us.

It is true that a majority of people out late at night are out there after boozing it up. Not all. I too have rolled in very late for a multitude of reasons as mentioned above. We all just need to step back, take a deep breath and realize that we all love this sport more than anything else (next to our families). We need to work TOGETHER to ensure its longevity. Sometimes that means doing what is best for the sport as a whole and not what is best for us individually.

STAY ON THE TRAIL POR STAY HOME just about sums that one up. Unfortunately, the morons who fail to follow these rules are typically the same people who do nothing to help their clubs if they even join one, they are extremely quick to complain about every little thing, and are too stupid to know the difference.

Think snow!

Shane

I can't tell you how many times I have argued this subject. I agree 100% about the drinking part. I find it sad when you stop at a relay and see all the snowmobilers sitting around with countless, empty beer bottles on their tables. Or, when your up in Old Forge and around 2 am the ambulance alarm goes off and you find out the next day that someone hit a tree 15 feet in the air after he missed a turn and hit a berm at about 90 mph, and, he was drunk. As for the loud pipes, especially at night, this is not the '70's people. Loud pipes are so dated. They serve no purpose at all. If you need more power, buy a bigger sled. If you know that nobody wants to hear them, not to mention that they are banned in just about all riding areas, why would you insist on putting them on? As far as staying on the marked trail, someone has to tell me why you just wouldn't do that out of respect to the landowner. I will admit that there were times when I'd be going through the fields in a whiteout and "lost" the markers. I think that the reflectors could be a little closer in some wide open areas. Everything Shane has said is 100% spot on. The typical person that falls into these categories are the little rich kid city slickers who get whatever they want from mommy and daddy and no matter what they do wrong, mommy and daddy get them out of it. They are the same people who have no clue how to act around a boat ramp, but, that's another forum. I know I'll get some flak for the people description but think about it.